How long is Willy's leash?

[Goalie]

2 minutes ago, Mr Dee said:

"We made some bad decisions, took bad penalties and made bad mistakes,"

Drew Willy? Nope - Mike Reilly.

That's what a real leader says. You wonder why his players go balls out for the guy. That's why. 

[Blueandgold]

40 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

the worst by a country mile? no sir, you need to watch more teams than just the jets. Could start locally in Calgary perhaps. 

You need to watch more Jets if you think that Pavlec is even somewhat okay.

[Tracker]

2 hours ago, 17to85 said:

You know what I would honestly do? When Willy gets the shell shocked look, and you can tell when it happens, I'd put Nichols in for a series or two just to give Willy a break and let him watch from the sidelines for a bit and then put him back in. The reluctance for coaches to use a 2 qb system these days is kind of silly when you don't have the superstar guy so why not for the sake of his mental game give Willy a break. Things snowball on this team, give them a chance to recover maybe. 

The problem with your suggestion is that it is anathema to O'Shea to do that sort of thing. There is a Sioux proverb that if your horse is dead it is time to dismount

[Adrenaline_x]

1 hour ago, 17to85 said:

I am not defending him so much as trying to expand people's focus. He's not the only problem on this team, not by a long shot.

No hes not, but he is the one that throws or hands off the ball. If you can't throw accurately or can't set your feet because you are panicking or read the defense, then the offence has ZERO chance of moving the ball.  If one reciever can't catch, you swap them our or don't throw to them.  

QB isn't like all the other parts of the team where they are the sum of the parts. If Willing was throwing the ball on target and the reciever is dropping it. running the wrong route or whatever thats one thing.. But when the QB is throwing into the dirt or under or over throwing, thats on the qb. 

 

 

[Mr Dee]

2 hours ago, 17to85 said:

You know what I would honestly do? When Willy gets the shell shocked look, and you can tell when it happens, I'd put Nichols in for a series or two just to give Willy a break and let him watch from the sidelines for a bit and then put him back in. The reluctance for coaches to use a 2 qb system these days is kind of silly when you don't have the superstar guy so why not for the sake of his mental game give Willy a break. Things snowball on this team, give them a chance to recover maybe. 

A move like this, to sit pretty Willy, for a bit, would be the way to go. It's like a mimed slap to the face. It should be done. It should have already been done. 

But this is an enormous weakness, or mis-belief, by our HC, and is added into data-accumulation information of misdeeds for MOS.

And that booklet is growing. And that's not good for O'Shea.

[blueandgoldguy]

1 hour ago, 17to85 said:

you're obsessed with Pavelec, why is that? I'll say this as someone who isn't even a huge Jets fan, Pavelec is an OK goalie, not perfect but OK. Not the guy to carry a team on his own but support him he can hold the fort. 

If by OK you mean below average backup goalie then you are correct.  A knowledgeable NHL fan knows this.  In fact, goalie save percentage (the best measure of the quality of goalie) if effected minimally by the quality of a team's defense in front of him.

 

When Pav's deal is complete he might find work a a backup in the NHL for a season or two.  Otherwise, he will be headed to Europe or become a career AHLer.

[blueandgoldguy]

1 hour ago, TBURGESS said:

To put it in perspective, Willy's being paid more than BLM, Harris and Collaros, all of whom are way better QB's. That's why you don't give a guy big bucks for potential. You give them big bucks only after they reach their potential.

Walters and O'Shea have placed all their bets on Willy as evidenced by their inactivity in the off-season.  They did not take one look at other quarterback options around the CFL thinking that the inconsistencies we all saw from him last season - prior to his injury - were nothing but a mirage.  So far, it looks like they chose the wrong path.  

[White Out]

The guy were paying 400,000 is so bad that even his defenders are suggesting when he gets shell shocked to take him out for a few series. Unreal. This is the definition of an abusive relationship when the abused (the fans) are stooping to such lows to try and defend the abuser (the team).

If one of the highest paid qb's in the league can't be effective you move on. If he's so bad that he has a glossy look of panic in his eyes at points in the game you cut him and fire the guy who paid him so much money.

Have our standards been lowered so far that this is a reasonable expectation now?

[Doc]

justin goltz was a better qb than drew willy. we won't be a good team till someone gets some cohonas and plays a real qb.

[White Out]

 

1 minute ago, Doc said:

justin goltz was a better qb than drew willy. we won't be a good team till someone gets some cohonas and plays a real qb.

What shouldn't be lost in that is Willy is making 400k. That's a lot of salary in the CFL to tie up in one the worst starter. We could have had Nichols starting behind a O line you just throw money at. But nope, Walters and MOS had to be the smartest guys in the room and really push this Willy fellow on us all to prove everyone wrong.

[Adrenaline_x]

3 hours ago, 17to85 said:

We most certainly do not. Not one of our current receivers are in the same stratosphere as Milt Stegall and I don't think any of them are comparable to Geroy Simon or Arland Bruce either. Dressler may or may not be, I would lean towards being a bit lower than those two, probably about Robert Gordon level. After that though none of those guys compare to the kinds of receivers we trotted out in the early 2000s. We got no one at all like Sellers on the team and let's say we call Roberts and Harris comparable that's still just one position. I know that this is the best group of receivers we've had in quite a while... but it's still lacking. 

How do you know though since the qb can't get the ball into their hands. 

Harris is as productive as Roberts with less dazzle.  

Milt was a superstar for sure but Brazil was hit or miss and Armand Bruce showed well but left.  

 

 

[17to85]

21 minutes ago, Adrenaline_x said:

How do you know though since the qb can't get the ball into their hands. 

Harris is as productive as Roberts with less dazzle.  

Milt was a superstar for sure but Brazil was hit or miss and Armand Bruce showed well but left.  

 

 

because we've seen a bunch of them around the league before. Dressler had some great years with the Riders, he was never on the level of Simon or Bruce. Brazzell I don't even count, he was garbage and also more mid 2000s when the team didn't do a lot of winning either. Smith is not at the level of Simon or Bruce either, I mean really is there much difference between what Smith has shown us and what Denmark did? I have very little belief in Adams, I think he's just another way of saying Aaron Kelly. Too inconsistent to really rely on. Who knows what Davis becomes but he's still a rookie. The amount of talent on those very early 2000s teams was mind blowing. 

[Root]

1 hour ago, Mr Dee said:

A move like this, to sit pretty Willy, for a bit, would be the way to go. It's like a mimed slap to the face. It should be done. It should have already been done. 

But this is an enormous weakness, or mis-belief, by our HC, and is added into data-accumulation information of misdeeds for MOS.

And that booklet is growing. And that's not good for O'Shea.

He who live by a sword stubborneth - die quickly despite rusty and unsharp blade!

[Root]

28 minutes ago, Adrenaline_x said:

How do you know though since the qb can't get the ball into their hands. 

Harris is as productive as Roberts with less dazzle.  

Milt was a superstar for sure but Brazil was hit or miss and Armand Bruce showed well but left.  

 

 

I think it was Arnold Bruce - not Armand. Kudos for the Bobo Brazil reference!

[Root]

3 hours ago, 17to85 said:

I am not defending him so much as trying to expand people's focus. He's not the only problem on this team, not by a long shot.

Agreed. Perhaps he's 60 to 65% of the problem. Air-drop an established man like Burris into the equation and he'd have the typical Winnipeg problem of getting to know his teammates, timing, new OC, unemotional head coach, etc. Hank would also take more abuse than Willy cuz he'd try to stretch his scampers by a few yds vs. Willy going into fetal position whenever tacklers enter his limited field of vision.

Glenn would be more effective hitting receivers but he'd be mincemeat behind our blocking schemes. Glenn can't run either - he'd be totally abused. Same with Ricky Ray. Ray can sometimes operate with 1.5 to 2 seconds - he'd be a tackling dummy here.

[17to85]

Burris would trip over his pouty bottom lip if he tried to deal with the **** Willy goes through. Burris is a great team mate when things go well but when things don't go well he's the biggest suck out there. 

[DR. CFL]

Not really sure where Burris has been when the situation sucked?

[Tracker]

3 hours ago, Mr Dee said:

A move like this, to sit pretty Willy, for a bit, would be the way to go. It's like a mimed slap to the face. It should be done. It should have already been done. 

But this is an enormous weakness, or mis-belief, by our HC, and is added into data-accumulation information of misdeeds for MOS.

And that booklet is growing. And that's not good for O'Shea.

If Tom Brady can be sat down (figuratively speaking), then there is no sane reason for Willy to keep being thrown out when it is obvious to the world that it just isn't happening for him. But we're talking about O'Shea here who has been remarkably resistant to learning from experiences.

[Guest J5V]

2 hours ago, blueandgoldguy said:

Walters and O'Shea have placed all their bets on Willy as evidenced by their inactivity in the off-season.  They did not take one look at other quarterback options around the CFL thinking that the inconsistencies we all saw from him last season - prior to his injury - were nothing but a mirage.  So far, it looks like they chose the wrong path.  

Sooner or later one of these poor decisions is going to cost them their job. Sooner or later.

[Taynted_Fayth]

are people talking about arland bruce? i have no recollection of an armand bruce or arnold lol

[Adrenaline_x]

Arland.     Auto correct

[iso_55]

Arnold Bruce... LOL!

[IC Khari]

[Eternal optimist]

9 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

Arnold Bruce... LOL!

Edited July 16, 2016 by Eternal optimist

[Fatty Liver]

5 hours ago, Mr Dee said:

A move like this, to sit pretty Willy, for a bit, would be the way to go. It's like a mimed slap to the face. It should be done. It should have already been done. 

But this is an enormous weakness, or mis-belief, by our HC, and is added into data-accumulation information of misdeeds for MOS.

And that booklet is growing. And that's not good for O'Shea.

Strange thing is O'Shea had all off-season to sit and think about this and learn from his mistakes.  Yet he comes back to work in the spring tied to the same erroneous convictions that are likely to cost him the biggest job of his life.  He preaches coaching and learning from mistakes every week but doesn't seem to follow that mantra himself.